Unpacked with Ron Harvey
People Always Matter. Join Ron as he unpacks leadership with his guests.
Unpacked with Ron Harvey
Harnessing Generational Strengths for Enhanced Productivity
Unlock the secrets to mastering remote work and leadership with guest Shane Spraggs, a leading productivity consultant from Canada. Shane shares his expert insights from his co-authored book, "The Power of Remote," as we explore the shifting dynamics towards remote and hybrid work models. Discover how companies are striking a balance between the productivity of working from home and the necessity of in-office social interactions, all while maintaining a healthy work-life balance. Shane's expertise offers a roadmap through the challenges and opportunities remote work presents for leaders today.
We delve into the strategic pivots leaders had to make when the pandemic disrupted traditional work environments. Learn how HR, managers, and leadership teams had to adapt quickly and why planning became a cornerstone of successful remote work strategies. Through engaging stories like the initial skepticism towards innovations like Uber, we underline the importance of embracing change and technology. Shane provides valuable insights into how remote project management and sales can be effectively executed, ensuring company values and culture remain strong even when teams are dispersed.
In an era where the workforce spans multiple generations, it's crucial to harness each group's diverse strengths. We discuss how open communication can bridge generational gaps and enhance productivity. Remote work isn’t just a trend; it’s reshaping employee retention and work-life balance while highlighting the need for a renewed focus on trade skills. Wrapping up, Shane introduces his new venture, Future Productivity, aimed at helping CEOs build trust in remote work environments. Join us as we thank our listeners and invite you to keep exploring leadership challenges with us every Monday on the Unpacked Podcast.
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The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the speakers and guests and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of any organization or entity. The information provided in this podcast is intended for educational and informational purposes only and should not be considered as professional advice. Listeners should consult with their own professional advisors before implementing any suggestions or recommendations made in this podcast. The speakers and guests are not responsible for any actions taken by listeners based on the information presented in this podcast. The podcast is not intended to be a substitute for professional advice or services. The speakers and guests make no representations or warranties of any kind, express or implied, about the completeness, accuracy, reliability, suitability or availability with respect to the information, products, services, or related graphics contained in this ...
Welcome to Unpacked Podcast with your host leadership consultant, Ron Harvey of Global Core Strategies and Consulting. Ron's delighted to have you join us as he unpacks and shares his leadership experience, designed to help you in your leadership journey. Ron believes that leadership is the fundamental driver towards making a difference. So now to find out more of what it means to unpack leadership, here's your host, Ron Harvey.
Speaker 2:Well, good afternoon. This is Ron Harvey. I'm the Vice President and the Chief Operating Officer for Global Course Strategies in Columbia, south Carolina, which is a leadership development firm. So, in a nutshell, anything to do with people and leaders being more effective to take care of the teams that they're responsible for and responsible to. And it's not about likership, it's really about leadership. But how do we be the best human being we can be to take care of people that are counting on us to get it right? So we love doing the work. We do a lot of executive coaching, strategic planning, retreats, things that just deal with bringing you and your teams together. So what we've noticed over time there's a big disconnect right now between leaders and the workforce, and we're trying to help close that gap. So we'd love to talk more about that. But this podcast is not about all the stuff that we do. You can find us on LinkedIn, you can go to our webpage and we'll be happy to have that conversation.
Speaker 2:Today is really about letting you behind the curtain and hear things that we probably don't even say in some of our workshops. So you get the peek behind the curtain with me and one of my guests. I'm super excited to always bring someone from around the globe, with different backgrounds, different perspectives, different experiences. I love diversity. If you don't notice that if you've been around me, I love diversity in all realms and we're challenged with it, but I still love it. So I want to bring on Shane and welcome him to the stage and give him the microphone. Shane welcome, thank you for saying yes, even without the questions, and then look and say, hey, where am I going on the show? Thank you, but I want to pause and give you the microphone, to give you permission and space to introduce yourself however you desire.
Speaker 3:Thanks so much, ron. It's a pleasure to be here. So yeah, my name is Shane Spragues. I'm a productivity consultant from up north in Canada, just about five hours east of Vancouver, and so I've been working for many, many years in the operations space as well. I did a stint at Disney, ran a couple of my own companies and just recently left Vertura.
Speaker 3:Vertura is a consulting firm out of the East Coast, so Nova Scotia, and I was working remotely with them, and while I was working there, myself and the executive chair, cynthia Watson, put our heads together and we wrote a book all about remote work. And so this book here called the Power of Remote, and it's a real heavy, thick book all about best practices of remote work. It came out last year in February, probably the worst time book in history, not maybe the worst time, but it happened to come out just as the return to office mandate started. But those you know. We started hearing around that time that you know remote work is dead, and then, about six months later, we started hearing the exact opposite. We've heard nothing but backlash against return to the office, and a lot of that is because we've discovered something over the last four years, and that is that there's a well-being, a work-life balance aspect to working in a role, and when people went home during the pandemic like, hey, I'm saving myself an hour and a half on average across North America commuting every day to work, also saving myself $55 an hour on average Again, this is average per day of going to the office. I'm seeing my kids more, I'm having more time for fun, more time for real life, and it can be more productive as well, provided and this will tie in nicely to what you guys do provided the leadership and management teams know what they're doing.
Speaker 3:So what we saw was, six months after the return to office mandate started, people started to push back and somewhere around September, october last year, we saw a much larger push back on that and now a lot of companies have kind of found a nice middle ground. If you were a company that was in the office before the pandemic and you're smaller, you're probably now more aligned with hybrid work. You've chosen two to three days a week where people can go work from home. We've also discovered that majority of know majority of the people don't necessarily want to work full-time from home. We also know that a majority of people don't want to work from the office full-time, and so most people want to find a happy medium in between there, and we're looking at the new future of work here, where it's not really hybrid, remote or office.
Speaker 3:It's digital first. It's doing your work where you can and doing the best work where it's needed. One last bit on that is that remote working from home and the isolation is great for being productive, getting tasks done. It's harder to create the plan remotely. It's better to do that in person, and so we have a great balance with a lot of these companies that have gone hybrid. Once they can harness that, they can build the social side of the business, they can do their planning, they can get together and do their brainstorming and then they can work. People can go home and get their job done.
Speaker 2:Yeah, shane, thank you for sharing, because it is a challenge. Those conversations are how do we figure it out? And I'll say everyone that's listening we're figuring out. As we do it, let's know if we're really transparent about it. We're going to try something, we're going to see how it works, we're going to get feedback, we're going to modify it, and that's what's happened. Covid put us in this position that no one had answers, but everybody was closed out. Everybody was pushed out, everybody had to. You couldn't shut down like everything, and you had to figure out sharing and people loved it and I thought I would pull the plug on it after COVID. But people say no, don't cancel it, it's still very helpful. So the idea that I use on there, shane, is how do you meet your people where they are?
Speaker 3:Well, that's a great question. So, first of all, talk to them. What do they need? And this is one of my biggest philosophies is to treat people like humans. So many businesses look at them as a resource, the whole concept of human resources. It's like you're ordering a stack of wood to go do a job. You've got to build a wall. No, you're hiring people. They're complex, they have needs, they can do amazing things, but they need to be nurtured, and so understanding the underlying needs of individuals is a great place to start, and so my background originally, way back when, was in software development, and this is you know.
Speaker 3:I'm very familiar with the 60 70 hour work weeks and you know I actually remember. One of the things I say is that at Disney, when I worked with Disney for a number of years I have photos in my family album from that time that I'm in and I don't remember because I was so overwhelmed with work stressed that my brain wasn't storing memories. I was there, but I wasn't really there. My kids were at an important age during that time, right, and I feel like I missed out on it.
Speaker 3:So I've always been very interested in this balance because, apart from that, I knew that I wasn't being as productive as I could be in 60, 70 hours and this is before the pandemic, right, I knew that no one works an eight hour a day. We don't really do this right. Yes, they take an hour for lunch, they take breaks, they go out, they find distractions. You know we've replaced the smoke break with the social media break and you're lucky if you get four to five hours out of an A player during the day and we get you know. So, building on those concepts, I'm really fascinated by what do people need to do their best job right, and leadership is definitely a huge part of it Out of your A players.
Speaker 2:The best bet is you'll get four to five good hours out of eight-hour workday. There's some truth to that for organizations. Now leaders may not want to hear that because they want to squeeze everything in those eight hours. They want to put 10 hours into those eight hours. Let's be realistic Versus they're going to get four. They're probably cringing right now. What do you mean? I'm not going to get four to five just listening to this podcast today. But how do you get the best four to five out of those individuals versus them having to? I call it forcing them to lie to you when they're going to do eight hours. I totally agree. So how do you do that intentionally? But I'm going a different direction for us. Right now you're talking about the power of remote Right. There's a study or research that's done by KPMG that says technology disruption is going to hit 88% of the workforce. Most companies will be hit with technology disruption. Here's the challenge Only 40% of us are actually prepared for it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, there's still monumental changes happening. I'll be the first to acknowledge that we haven't found the balance around hybrid work either. We haven't seen the last of remote work For me I'll connect this very soon here. But very simply, look at the companies that are going to come in the next few years.
Speaker 3:If you're starting a new business now, it makes no sense, absolutely no sense to rent an office. Let's say you had two or three people get together in a town or city and they said let's start something big. Well, they're not going to invest, you know, five to $6,000 a month in rent and desks and paper for the you know, so on and so forth to make their office work. They're going to hold off on that as long as they can, yes, but in that time they're going to start hiring people from all over the world because they can't. They're going to hire the best people for the job.
Speaker 3:I don't know when in the history of a new company they're going to say, hey, now's the time to invest a bunch of money in an office. Well, where are we going to put it? Yeah, you know, we got, yes, 10 of our people on the east coast, 20 in the west coast and the rest of them in the middle, somewhere, and maybe somewhere off in a different country altogether. So I'm curious to see what happens going forward. And apart from that, we also have AI, ai is coming in.
Speaker 3:It made a big splash last year. I use it daily. I use it to help me be a better writer, I use it to help me remember how to do processes and whatnot. I think we're starting to see some of the rough around the edges right now, but we're seeing the potential of it, where it's going to go, and I've heard one person say that any remote job where you have a person who does their work from the computer, from their house, could theoretically be replaced by an AI bot at some point. Now, if that's true, what does that do to society? And there's a huge bunch of questions, and so it's a lot to answer, and there's so much else going on in the world right now that can change the direction of work. So it is where are we going the next year? What's the next thing to work on? And I'm just constantly curious and looking for the next best things to help that pendulum shift and switch.
Speaker 2:Yeah, which I think is important, shane that every leader should be curious. The minute, I think, you lose curiosity, the minute you lose the leverage, if you will, the opportunity to be a part of it. So if you're standing waiting versus being curious about what's next, and you let the fear drive your decisions, I think you get left behind. So AI is here, I mean, and people say, well, it's going to replace human beings. Oh, well, we're worried about the integrity of it. Oh, we're worried about the plagiarism, like, all that is still accurate. They've always worried about all that. It's just it. So, if AI can allow you to ask a question which I can remember today is going to a library, shane, and I will have to pull four or five books and sit them on the table and from page to page, and I'm pulling data points and all over. Well, I can literally say, okay, ai is a library, it's pulling research and I still got to read it, understand it and put them to my own language. But we've always done it.
Speaker 3:We're just doing it smarter now. Well, and I also, I'm old enough to remember when photoshop came out and people at the time were up in arms saying, oh, this is going to decimate the ad business because people are going to be able to make ads from home. Well, it didn't, it just made it more successful, right?
Speaker 3:yes, it allowed us to do more things, and there's been similar changes in history. You know from technology all movies these days have a lot of computer technology renders in them. At one point it was claymation for these sorts of things. At some point that changed and it's just these things we go through. Nothing's going to take it all away from us at any given time. It's just going to open the door up for it to be more options, more opportunities, unlike when this happened with the internet. I'm less clear what that's going to be with AI, but I think it's just going to make us all more successful. It's going to take a lot of maybe dull jobs off the list. Some people do enjoy doing data entry, but maybe we won't have to do that anymore, or maybe a generalist can be able to do that and we'll really rely on it for more and more and more over the years and we'll see where it takes us.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely. So let's dive in here, shane. I mean, you had an opportunity. You wrote a book with a friend, a colleague, so the power of remote what prompted you to write the book and what did you learn through that process?
Speaker 3:Well, I'll give full props to Cynthia. She's been doing remote work for years and far longer than I have. Her experience has been with project teams and individuals. My experience when I brought in was more from the executive leadership side and management side. I learned quickly. When I first joined Routira and Mel, we combined those two competencies to put this book together. It just felt like the right book at the right time.
Speaker 3:We started this project just at the start of the pandemic. As most books do, it took longer than we expected, and then we also had to deal with things like I'm not sure if you remember, but distributing anything back in the pandemic was very tough, and so it took seven months to get to the stores where in the previous to the pandemic that would have taken six weeks. So there's some challenges, and the key thing around the book is that, from my perspective, when the pandemic happened, the majority of the workers were ready to go home. Most of them just picked their laptops up and they went home, and it wasn't that much of a different work experience. They still connected over email. They still had their work in front of them. A lot of them obviously had to deal with a lot of stress related to the pandemic.
Speaker 3:There were three groups of people who struggled greatly when this happened. The first was HR. They weren't ready to work remotely. Hiring people, firing people is really tough remotely and a number of other things building engagement and that sort of thing. Managers were also really struggling through this time.
Speaker 3:I mean, we had problems with good managers before the pandemic and now we just ask them. You have to work without being able to see or touch your staff or learn from other managers, so good luck. And then the third was the leadership team. How do you strategize, how do you plan, how do you motivate your team, how do you lead your team when you can't see them? And so those are the three areas we focused on in the book. And then we have a section at the end about remote project management as well as remote sales, sales being this one role that's always been remote, so there's some gems in there for that, but it's not necessarily directed at the employee. It's directed at the people who work with employees. There's some good things in there for the employees as well, but I think if you're a manager, this is the right book for you.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes. And leaders, you always have to be growing, you always have to be figuring out new ways. And it's here in front of us, it's not going anywhere local grocery store where you check yourself out. Now, that's here to stay. Yes, yes. So yeah, I can remember when Uber first came out and I was in Arizona and people were like Uber, like who's getting in a car with a stranger that you don't know to drive you somewhere?
Speaker 3:So I was sitting there and I'm listening.
Speaker 2:I'm curious, no-transcript. Like you've always gotten in the car with a stranger in a taxi, like what's the problem? And people are like you're right, I said yeah, so it's a different thing, but it's the same thing. You've always gotten in the car anytime in a taxi, and you did not know the driver Exactly. Yeah, you knew the company name, but that was it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, like you, I also remember the shock of getting into an Uber and then leaving and so, okay, do I have to do anything? I don't have to pay him or her, just leave. Get out of the car, yeah, and then just suddenly realize how you know again, technology, that was the big advantage there, right, yeah?
Speaker 2:And so, when you think about the work that you're doing, shane, and what you're interested in doing, what are some of the things you're noticing that leaders have to do in order to really have the power over this remote?
Speaker 3:space. For me, it's about understanding the fundamentals first, and for me, there's four really important things to keep in mind with a remote business. The first is intention. Remote businesses do not work on organic, this whole idea. Oh, we organically come up, innovate or solve problems or collaborate. Being organic is just another way of saying lucky, we had no plan for it and it just happened Fantastic.
Speaker 3:You have to be intentional. That means that you have to sit down and understand what you want in your business and be prescriptive around all the things that you know. Who are we as a business? What do we value? And from a leadership standpoint, these are the big things. Where are we going? What's our purpose? What are our priorities? This year? And we already had an issue.
Speaker 3:Again, I like to remind people that businesses weren't perfect before the pandemic and we already had an issue with most companies. You went into them maybe midway through the year and you asked them hey, what are our priorities for this year? Good luck on them being able to pick them out right. Name one of our five values. Couldn't do that either. Name our purpose or mission statement. Oh, I can't. So what was again this is just a way of mindset here what was largely happening in the office, that people came to work for a good work-life atmosphere. Yes, and some of the cultural things that may have been passed down by the leader may have also benefited as well, and there's the rare few of people who had the opportunity to pick a job that really aligned with their values maybe solving an important problem or, you know, charitable issues or so on and so forth, but remotely.
Speaker 3:A leader's job is to constantly remind people of those important things, and so you know you take every opportunity to share the mission of the vision of the company. If you have a, you know, monthly or quarterly, all hands or all staff, you open it up with that. Hey guys, this is so-and-so. We're here to do this, and it might feel contrived the first few times you do it, but people will start to appreciate it. Share values. Make sure that your values are things that people can make decisions on. So none of this. We have integrity.
Speaker 3:Integrity is not really a value a company should use. That is a value that we should expect in a decent human being and we should hire for. If you get to a situation and you're at a dilemma, you don't know what to do next and it calls on you to use one of your values to make a decision, and that value is integrity. Hmm, I guess we should do the most. Let's be honest about this.
Speaker 3:So vertura's got a good value that we follow a lot and I'll share as an example say no to fire drills. It's very basic, it works for our company, and the fire drill is any activity or thing that comes up that's urgent but not important, and we remind everyone, including the leaders of the business. Get reminded hey, is that a fire drill? Oh yeah, you're right, we can put this aside and get back the work in hand. It's just one of the business.
Speaker 3:Get reminded hey, is that a fire drill? Oh yeah, you're right, we can put this aside and get back to the work at hand. It's just one of the values, right, yes, so take every opportunity to remind people of those. You often start meetings with an icebreaker who lived our values this last week and you get people to talk about that, and so those things take time, and it requires that the leader has a very clear understanding of the purpose of the business, why they're there and what the plan is, and to ensure that every bit of work that the team members are doing creates value for the company along the lines of the plan that they had for that year.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think you're spot on too, shane, when you start thinking about a lot of companies. The things that they have down as values are things you should expect of human behavior good, decent human beings and I've watched corporations we go in that either. That's not what it is. It's more about telling people how to have ethical behavior versus values, but then they tend to be long and nobody can remember, can even regurgitate, or I mean, on their best day, they read it. They still don't get it sometimes because they've made it so comprehensive versus keeping it simple. So I will say, as you're listening, for every leader that's out there how do whatever you have written down whether it's on the board or whether it's on your internet or whether it's on your website how do you see that in action? And if you can't like, say it with a picture. It may be too long and people ask me what do you mean, ron? I say, well, think about it.
Speaker 2:If you're ever driving in a car, how many road signs don't have any words at all, but there's a picture and you know exactly what to do. Excellent, yeah, there's like a railroad crossing that has two R's in this. Yeah, so when you think about those things. How many of your values can you put a road sign next to and I know what I should or should not do what's important to us? So can you create enough road sounds in your organization for people to get your values? So I love that you brought it up, because it's in the vision and all that stuff. Can I see it without reading it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so as we look at our time here, one of the things that a lot of leaders are struggling with right now are five generations in the workforce on top of all this remote stuff. You hear well, people don't want to work anymore and the generations are different and they don't really care and they don't have all of what the negative connotation around. Yeah, every generation comes with it. So for those that are in different generations, we all hear someone the generation before us talked about how horrible we were or how horrible we are. That happens in every generation. But how do you help leaders begin to leverage all five generations without the negative talk about how they're so different?
Speaker 3:I'm a big proponent in talking to people and asking them get their feedback. I know there's generational differences. I think the media leans into them far too much in a lot of cases. I've got a couple of daughters who are of the youngest generation and one of their strengths is going to be technology. They've grown up with it. My oldest is no less committed, or probably more committed, to the work that she's doing than I was at that age, and it's easy for someone who's older look back and with the wisdom I have these days and assume that the person who's 20 or 25 years old who doesn't have that wisdom is defective and is not doing it well.
Speaker 3:I think that there's a lot of things that changed over time. In my father's day, it was pretty expected that you would join a company, stay with them for 25 years and get a gold watch and a retirement plan and they would take care of everything for you. This day and age, I think the businesses have done a lot of disservice to the working class by creating disposable roles. You know we saw this last year significant layoffs in the tech sector, whether they are warranted or not, you know, I'm sure some of them were A lot of them. You could argue that were done because you know it gave a bump to the stock price and that was what's more important to them. You know it gave a bump to the stock price and that was what's more important to them. So I think, as businesses, I think we have to do is we have to come at it from again a human perspective, care for our employees and things like remote work. That's a really good feature to offer for a role that is known to improve retention. Yes, right.
Speaker 2:Yes, it is, and even our company company shame. You think about our organization. We don't have a brick and mortar building, but we have employees in five different states as a small business, and the advantage is that they get to live their life and it's not built all around work, and so it's not like they live to work versus work to live. They enjoy the things they do. They can do from anywhere in the world, as long as they have a laptop and a cell phone. Get it done. Yeah, and so the reality for all of us, as we're watching where we're moving towards, is the world is changing around us, but I think I see a lot of people struggling with changing.
Speaker 3:Yeah Well, there's always a few people cast aside when these big changes happen. Unfortunately, Right and in a lot of places in Canada, we have a huge deficit in people who do trades. I think as a society, we've probably over-invested in knowledge workers and, as technology comes along to either replace us or make our jobs easier, we are finding we actually need more people who can pick up a hammer and build something. That's not something that's going to be easy to change overnight, but I know that there was a lot of stories throughout the pandemic of people who left their jobs and found roles and bakeries and other you know, types of businesses that they found more replenishing you know that it was more valuable to them, and so those stories are, hopefully you know, shining light of what you know, some people who may be struggling because they can't find a role in the technology role.
Speaker 3:I think a lot of the responsibility comes to the business to take all that we know about what people enjoy about working, what makes a good work environment, and that you know generational issues will be on the news as opposed to in your walls.
Speaker 2:Yes, thank you. I want to be able to highlight the book again. So I know you have it with you, but can you put a plug in for the book? Where do they get it? You've already told us plenty about it, but this is a shameless plug. Let's plug the book again. Where can people find that? Because I want people to support what you're doing and it's a great thing to start talking about. So, let me move out of your way and let's drop this plug in for the book again. Thanks, Sarah.
Speaker 3:So, yeah, this is the Power Remote launched last February. It's available on Amazon. One of the things I'm proud about is that it was Amazon bestseller for a short bit and even now it has nothing but fours and fives reviewed for it, and that was my primary concern about putting a body workout that. You know that. You always. You know how this goes. We'll take one negative complaint against 10 good compliments. But so far it's been very well received. But so far it's been very well received. As I said, a lot of information in there. I'm available on LinkedIn. I'm happy to connect with anybody through LinkedIn. I do my best to continue sharing my thoughts on LinkedIn as well, and you can catch me there, shane Sprague. You'll see it in the title of this podcast, so you should be easy to track me down.
Speaker 2:Awesome. Thanks, shane. As you're in the business that you're doing now, who's your ideal client? Who are the people that you want to do work with? What would they be experiencing? Going through that says hey, call Shane.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so my new business actually is called Future Productivity. We are helping CEOs deal with the erosion of trust caused by remote and hybrid work. What's happened is that because people haven't put in the proper guardrails into how to run a business, they haven't been intentional, for example, they haven't been transparent or proactive with their business they left leaders in this state of mind where they see their employees go home and they wonder what are you doing all day? And that's the wrong thing. And so we are helping CEOs with that type of scenario where we can help them both create a plan so that they feel they're informed what their business is doing and also, along the way, help the employees be both profitable and productive.
Speaker 3:Our target market right now is any business from 20 to 100 person, likely hybrid work, and typically they've been in business for a couple of years. The issues aren't with their sales and marketing. Their issues are with the operations and getting more done with the people they have, and they're probably a single owner operator who's at this point where they're wearing too many hats and they don't know it, but the entire team does. They're the type of person who may not allow the marketing person they hire to run a marketing campaign without their input. We've all know this person. They put their hands in and they micromanage. We understand them, we sympathize with them and we want to help them out, make their business more successful and help their team be more productive.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, thank you, Shane. Thank you for dropping the plug for the organization and the work that you're doing For all of you that's listening. Thank y'all for staying with us and joining us on the podcast and sharing it with your colleagues and your friends. Continue to push out podcasts for you with information that can be useful across the landscape, from people around the entire globe, so continue to join us. We release a podcast every Monday.
Speaker 2:Again, this is Ron Harvey, the Vice President and Chief Operating Officer for Global Core Strategies and Consulting. You can find us on LinkedIn. Everything People. We complement the HR departments. We work with leaders so they can be more effective at taking care of the people that they're responsible for and responsible to. In a nutshell, we love helping you be better at taking care of the people. That's going to help you become better. Thank you for joining with us. Shane and I are going to sign off for today and until next time. You guys have a wonderful week, be safe, stay cool as you can. It's hot in South Carolina. It's also hot in Canada right now.
Speaker 1:So please stay cool, wherever you may be at, and thank y'all for joining. Until next time we're going to sign off. Well, we hope you enjoyed this edition of Unpacked Podcast with leadership consultant Ron Harvey. Remember to join us every Monday as Ron unpacks sound advice, providing real answers for real leadership challenges. Until next time, remember to add value and make a difference where you are, for the people you serve, because people always matter.
